1). HoW was totally OP, and as much as it hurts me to say it, the nerf had to happen.

2). There’s too much focus on lvl 80 dps figures; essentially, Rets were given a tremendous boost to single-targets in 4.0.1. In reality, now 4.0.3a has hit, we are still doing more damage on single-targets than in 3.3.5 (although substantially less than in the previous patch).

3). Some people are completely dismissing the concept of appropriate scaling. Looking at the changes to Exo and HW in particular, spell scaling (especially at 85) seems to provide a more tangible means of achieving higher dps rather than straight base value increases.

4). PVP for ret has been seriously hurt by 4.0.3a, from both a burst damage perspective and self-healing point of view. Then again, the buff to the Crusader talent may somewhat negate the nerf to the Protector of the Innocent talent.

All in all, although a little disappointed with the noticeable damage reduction, I do believe that at 85 the Ret build will be a feasible dps spec in PVE. In regards to PVP, I think Blizz have been too quick to make the cuts to really appreciate the knock on effect (especially all levels leading up to 85).

Just my 2 cents

Astra~

Soz had to get that off my chest. Now back to post. while exo has been buffed if your considering adding to so called left hand rotaion, its still in combo class (right hand mouse fcfs) due to cast time. im currently leading in with judge Cs and plausing b4 Hw. Plausing b4 Hw to allow tank get aggro and to stack tanks stun affect on mobs. only using Ds on mobs and as filler in fcfs. Reforging haste at 80 is delicate but achievable to acceptable 3 attack speed. marco’ing Dp and zeal helps heaps. i also have How on middle mouse key just for fun. hope this helps. C

p.s Keep up the good work

I am not much of a PvPer but I get by. Usually the only PvP I do is defending myself against would-be gankers. Human racial + wings + HoW stops most, then add in HoJ and Bubble, well… Let’s put it this way, while in Gilneas my resto druid got flagged by running through Horde territory earlier. A tauren warrior ganked her – total blue wall. So I popped wings, two-shotted him, then I CS/Word of Glory my way to victory through his mage and rogue buddies. I admit, it was not like they were an arena team and working well together but neither am I.

On the topic of class DPS though, Blizz said (somewhere along the lines concerning Cata rebalancing) that hybrid DPS classes (DKs, warriors, paladins, shaman, druids, etc…) aren’t supposed to do (ideally) the same level of DPS as a pure DPS class (mage, lock, rogue, hunter). Not sure if they are sticking to that. To be honest, I wouldn’t mind a bit of a nerf in exchange for utility and having that utility be… you know… useful. With class homogenization, and the “bring the player not the class” mentality, I doubt any class will offer any real utility unique to them. My main was a hunter, and I prided myself on trapping and kiting from zombie chow to Faction Champions to the Blood Beasts, back when… you know… it was bad for melee to AOE them down. XD

I have to admit that PvP now has returned to be a pain, almost like it was on the first steps of tbc, when the standard sentence I heard was something like “retribution? AHAHAHAH respec holy”. Burst is gone unless using Wings/HoW combo, I almost can’t damage several classes: being kited to death, cced or overhealed is the standard(priest and mages as usual, not to mention druids and rogues… damn, rogues were my favourite dish in WOTLK bgs). I find the so long whished kick almost useless, as 80% of heals used in pvp are instacast or too quick to be effectively kicked (I’ve had lots of pvp with more than decent results, not a genius of course, but I’ve always been able to kick when needed… and now this happens almost… uhu… never… when I could kick I’m usually cced, stunned, distanced, freezed, dazed, confused… )

What to say? last season, retries were really over the top in BGs and almost sucking in Arenas, where the big deal was. Now the top PvP will be BGs… and we’re nerfed here… someone has to be laughing heavily at us, in a dark corner of Blizzard palace

And requiring more blue than reds on our most common meta, sounds really, really like a bad tasted joke -.-”

these changes will be old in a few weeks time and there will be more changes. We will either get buffed or nerfed. It’s the way of it. But as Gravetender simply states. If its not enjoyable then many rets will stop playing. Unless you only enjoy the levelling / questing aspect of the game then end game is a bit disappointing.

My ret is my main. I have it at a decent gear and Tear set up. jemmed and enchanted to the eyeballs. I can easily hit 11 – 15 k dps in raids. it has taken me an age to get to this place but if from what im reading we have been knocked back down again I may stop playing it myself and get my mage up and running instead. shame really.

I know not everyone can be pleased. But I thought the testing in the Beta servers is the reason for ironing out things. Its like fixing a broken bone with just a band aid, realising it isn’t working then shoving another one on top. When in reality is should of just been fixed properly before release in the first place. that’s the idea of testing surely.

I’ve not had a chance to play since I downloaded all the new items. I’ve done a couple of pilgrim achieves and hopefully ill get to king talan ikriss (sp) with me hat and robe on for another one later today. wife willing. But for some reason even though the new changes to the world are fantastic and exciting I feel a little less excited about playing it on my main. shame really.

Ret Pala in PvP is well pretty much a target without a healer buffing you whilst you try to get 3hp and proximity to target, AW HoW is great but during the cooldown on it i think just hide because you are no danger to anything except your own repair bill. I seem to find the almost constant silences and stuns mess more heavily with our class than any other, every second silenced is more time you are target no1 on the bg. To make our dire situation even worse the Mages, DK’s and Priests and Shammies seem to be having a faceroll time in PvP and raid damage meters… and they seem to be getting buffed as we are nerfed further, i can only summise that Blizz doesnt play a Ret Palla.

Overall i think the changes to Ret are all damaging to the classes long term existence in Cata, Blizz bleeds on about Balance but it seems that they must be weighing a different version of balance than the dictionary prescribes. Our raid positions are already becoming doubtful with only decent damage on static bosses and even this doesnt compare to other classes that out perform us in aoe, PvP we are nerfed to oblivion.

I love my Ret, but it is wasted time and effort playing a class that even with perfect timing and skill you are going to be substandard, for that reason i quit the game for a while to wait and see if any further changes are implemented.

sorry that i am so negative but thats the way it is

sorry that i am so negative but thats the way it is